The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama Alive.

Now that Senator Obama is surging in the polls it may be time to openly discuss some of the issues that have previously, at least in my observations, not been discussed here.  These are issues which are critical in terms of the Democratic Party's need to win the Whitehouse in November.    I am referring to the delicate matter of Obama's electability.

I would like to preface my comments with the very true and sincere declaration that I think Senator Obama is treasure to the Democratic Party.  I loved him since I first saw his speech at the 04 Dem Convention in Boston, long before he was talked by Oprah into running for the presidency.   I will always love and appreciate the man, but my affection for the senator does not outweigh my desire to see a Democratic president in the Whitehouse in January 2009.  Not by a long shot.

It appears as though the Democratic electorate has narrowed the choice of who will be the nominee between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama (Edwards seems to have faded fast except in Iowa, and nobody else seems to be able to mount a serious threat).  Therefore, Democrats need to ask themselves who has the best chance of winning the general election next November.

Anyone who has been paying any attention to politics in the last couple of decades has seen the rising ferocity and viciousness of the "Republican Attack Machine", whose nasty, character-assassinating commercials appear in the weeks before critical elections.  These people have no shame.  From the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth who questioned John Kerry's patriotism to the blond, white woman claiming she met Harold Ford Jr. at the Playboy mansion (which ,incidentally, proved that one's character can be assassinated in a racist fashion without making an explicitly racist statement), these people have shown themselves beyond any reasonable bounds of decency in their quest for electoral victory.  At this critical juncture in American history, Democrats must be prepared for the dirtiest political fight imaginable.

It is therefore appropriate to ask not only who is the more refreshing candidate, or the more likable, but also to assess that candidate's vulnerabilities to the Rebublican Attack Machine.  If Democrats are blind to the fact that racism exists and will play a relevant role in the coming election, they will again be doomed to defeat, and America will again suffer another term or two under a right-wing, tax-cutting Republican who is completely incompatible with progressive ideals.   In my opinion, this must not be allowed to happen, and therefore every Democrat should make, for each candidate, the necessary assessment of electability, even if these deliberations are cold and calculative.  All is fair in love, war and politics.

So, at the risk of being called a bigot (I was on the receiving end of this accusation the last time I made these observations publicly) here are Obama's vulnerabilities in terms of electability:

His name, Barrack Hussein Obama, will be mercilessly ridiculed.  As has been pointed out on numerous occasions, his middle name is shared by one enemy of America, and his last name has a strange resemblance to another.  One can imagine now the Republican ads:  "Think Obama can find Osama?!"  Anyone who doesn't think such tactics could result in reduced support for the senator from Illinois need only look at what happened to Kerry and Ford.  Both were attacked unfairly, and both lost their respective elections.

Obama's Muslim heritage (his father, and the time he spent  at a Muslim religious school as a boy in a Muslim country) will also be thrust, in a very unflattering way, into the face of the average American before the election.   Almost no political observers today are unaware of the tremendous voting power of the religious right, as well as its deep influence over much of the American populace.  The leaders of this community believe that Islam is conspiring to destory America.  One can only imagine the hysterical rhetoric they would produce in comparing the white decent former pastor Mike Huckabee with the "Muslim" Senator Barrack "Hussein" Obama.   Folks, this WILL happen if Obama is the nominee.  Don't doubt it for a second.  And these attacks will surely be effective.  

Finally, Obama's admitted history of drug use will be hailed as "proof" of his unworthiness to be an American leader.  There has never been an American president who admitted to taking cocaine.  In today's climate such information could be politically lethal.  Sure, this information has been out for a while now, but should Obama be the nominee, it will come back to haunt him in a very detrimental way.

Put all these attacks together and you have yourself one hell of a fight on your hands.  A fight that must not be lost, and making such a vulnerable candidate the nominee would put Democrats in a very disadvantaged position right of the bat.   Some Obama supporters might be quick to argue that his election to the senate proves he can withstand the heat.   But Obama's victorious senate campaign benefited greatly by a number of fortunate events which should not be counted on to happen again:  One of his opponents, Blair Hull, was accused of domestic abuse.  Another, Jack Ryan, withdrew after embarrassing allegations about his sexual past.  Finally, Obama faced off against Alan Keys - not exactly a tough opponent - to win the election.

Obama himself seems to be somewhat concerned by the prospect of the vicious attacks that are lurking around the corner, as well as the "dirt from the past" that might be revealed at any moment.  Just a few days ago, when Robert Novak suggested, without any apparent shred of evidence, that the Clinton campaign had dug up dirt on Obama and was prepared to use it for political gain, Obama appeared severely rattled.  He not only believed the charge without any question, he issued a knee-jerk, retaliatory statement accusing the Clinton campaign of "slime politics".  The Clinton campaign's response was, I think, right on the money:

"A Republican-leaning journalist runs a blind item designed to set Democrats against one another. Experienced Democrats see this for what it is. Others get distracted and thrown off their games," said Mo Elleithee, Clinton's campaign spokesman. "Voters should be concerned about the readiness of any Democrat inexperienced enough to fall for this."

As the campaigns wind down, these ugly realities must be considered.  And Democrats must ask themselves if it is more important to show the world that this refreshing young senator is good enough to be considered seriously for president (which has already been accomplished), or for the Democrats to come out victorious come next November?  It very likely can't be both.  



Display:


Obama is a political puppy. (2.00 / 1)

On a completely different topic, I figured out why Obama always turns his head away from the camera a lot.

Watch him when he is on camera.  He will turn his head as if he is looking at someone to the left more than he looks straight ahead.  I couldn't figure out why.

Now I do.  He is doing it to hide his big ears from the camera.  When he looks straight ahead it looks like he has two dinner plates sticking out from his head.  

I still can't figure seems to favor looking left when doing this vs. right.  Maybe he think he is showing off his good side.   Not sure.

But the Republicans will beat him easier than Edwards or Clinton.  They will race bait the whole election.  Sadly, it will be effective in some states.  Ohio comes to mind instantly.


by dpANDREWS on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 10:07:55 AM EST

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

"...He is doing it to hide his big ears from the camera.  When he looks straight ahead it looks like he has two dinner plates sticking out from his head. "

LOL. I needed a good laugh dp.


by lonnette33 on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 10:24:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

I am not going to be offended by that comment. I hope you guys dont get offended when we make fun of Hillary's mug or her shrill voice.


by Pravin on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:35:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

Lighten up Pravin dp just made a joke.


by lonnette33 on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:52:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

I am not offended. I was just warning you people to take our jokes in the same stride.


by Pravin on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:02:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

Enjoy.
http://www.funnyhub.com/pictures/pages/s cary-hillary-clinton.html
by Pravin on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:07:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

you wouldn't laugh if i said hillary wears pants to hide her fat ankles, and her fat ass.


I really don't understand how that is an attack; lol. ~ by Jerome Armstrong
by jello on Wed Dec 05, 2007 at 01:36:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

LOL good one jello.


by lonnette33 on Wed Dec 05, 2007 at 03:35:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

LOL no need for the chubby jab!


by lonnette33 on Wed Dec 05, 2007 at 03:36:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (2.00 / 2)

dpandrew,

The Republican machine will destroy Obama.

Without a doubt, he would be a much easier candidate to defeat than an Edwards, a Clinton, a Dodd or a Biden.

Race baiting, Muslim baiting, Husseing baiting- unfortunately these will be very effective in enough states including many swing states.

People here keep forgetting or simply ignoring that fact that there are still MILLIONS of Ignorant voters across our nation. And unfortunately, this will be enough for them to not vote for Obama.

You say Ohio. Absolutely!

Ohio voted against their pocketbooks in 2000 & 2004 in the name of gays & abortion.

Unfotunately, you can replicate that to a dozen critical states.

People here who keep talking about HOPE are in denial big time! Doing some Positive Thinking will not change the millions of people who are ignorant.


by labanman on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 10:31:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

I think it's ironic that when someone mentions Clinton's sex as a electoral liability, there is a hysterical reaction from Clintonites, saying whoever says that is a sexist etc.  I am not saying a conversation about Obama's electibility should be a forbidden topic of conversation.  I just hate the constant double standard.

FWIW I think any Democrat will win the election because we will be in a recession by election time, if we are not in one already.  It is because we are going to win that it is so important to nominate someone who will run and govern as a progressive-something that either Obama or Edwards will do and HRC will not.


Andy Katz
by Andy Katz on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 11:08:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (2.00 / 1)

Katz says,

>>any Democrat will win the election because we will be in a recession by election time<<

Did you miss the 2000 & 2004 elections ???

Number 1)In 2000,  We were coming off the Most prosperous & peaceful time in U.S. history under democrat Bill Clinton. What happened? Gore lost!
To even rely on Florida to win instead of winning by a wide margin was inexclusable.

Number 2) In 2004, we just got out of a Bush recession & were in the middle of a Very Unpopular War. What happened? Bush still won!

Katz, you are using the "Old" model of relying on pocketbook issues. Due to today's HOT Button Issues like Gay Marriage, Abortion, Immigration- Pocketbook issues are LESS RELIABLE in terms of predicting victory.

The last two presidential elections are a perfect example of that.

As I've said, Ohio has been struggling financially for the last 8 years, but people still voted for Bush twice!


by labanman on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 02:42:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is a political puppy. (none / 0)

He is doing it to hide his big ears from the camera.  When he looks straight ahead it looks like he has two dinner plates sticking out from his head.  

and hillary wears pants to hide her fat ankles, not to mention her fat ass.

isn't so cute when the shoes on the other side, is it?


I really don't understand how that is an attack; lol. ~ by Jerome Armstrong
by jello on Wed Dec 05, 2007 at 01:34:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Big Issue for Non-Obama supporters (2.00 / 2)

This Diary just hit the bullseye.

This is probably one of the most if not the biggest concern Non-Obama supporters have with a Barack Obama candidacy.

Whether you are an Edwards, Clinton, Richardson, or Biden supporter.- many of you & us feel this way. Its a HUGE CONCERN with Obama.

Every political expert, backed by every poll will tell you that Democrats have a slight advantage in the 2008 Presidential race due primarily to the Bush disaster. Our congressional candidates have a bigger, more defined advantage going into '08.

However, every politcal guru will also admit that the Republicans still have a good shot of winning & retaining the Presidency. A lot of it will depend on who the candidates are for both parties & how things go with Iraq & the Bush dynasty by '08.

In other words, its still going to be a dog fight. A bitter, nasty, below the belt war between the Right Wing machine & the Democratic party in '08. They will do everything to hang-on to their last & only hope of control. They know that the House & Senate will almost surely stay Democrat.

Barack Obama will go into this as a neophyte, Never been  tested candidate. Never experienced or seen how powerful & nasty these attacks happen.

In fact, his one state victory to stardom was a landlslide victory agains the weakest statewide Republican candidate in the history of VERY BLUE Illinois.

How hot can it get? How bad can it get? He can ask John Kerry! A 25 year political veteran. A Vietnam vet hero who was destroyed by the right wing machine.

This my friends is the Absolute Biggest fear of non-Obama supporters in a Obama candidacy.

The Presidency will be 100 times harder, nastier than  being a community street leader. 20 times harder than being a rookie Senator from a Very Blue state.

Being a Liberal African-American itself WILL ALREADY BE such a Big challenge to win in a national arena- Add the untested, very little experience into the mix- Sorry, this election is way too important to be playing games!

Hundreds of thousands of Democrats will NOT have a good night sleep if Obama is our candidate.

His last 18 months prior to announcing his candidacy was ALL a FAIRY TALE story. No other politician in history got that kind of $ 100 milion of FREE, UNCHALLENGED Advertising from Time Magazine, People, Newsweek, NBC, CNN & the rest of the MSM.

He won't know how HOT the kitchen is until he is actually in it.

This is nothing personal. Its simply the FEELING of millions of democrats who have decided to support another democrat for President.

Is a VERY FAIR, LEGITIMATE & REALISTIC concern about Barack Obama as the nominee.

Symbolic? Yes. Making History? Absolutely!

But I'm sorry, with ALL THAT is happening in America today -  WE CANNOT AFFORD to be cute or make history. We cannot afford to lose without putting the strongest candidate possible.


by labanman on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 10:23:13 AM EST

Re: Big Issue for Non-Obama supporters (none / 0)

The key is to respond forcefully, dramatically, and some would argue, unfairly against Republican attacks.  John Kerry should have placed the blame for Swiftboating squarely in George Bush's lap.  It is not actually true that Bush was behind Swiftboats, but that's entirely beside the point.  The point is to create a narrative.

I agree that it is an open question whether Obama will fight back hard enough against these attacks.  But my opinion is that it all matters who the campaign handlers are.  They will tell the candidate how to respond.  There is a chance that since Obama is an outsider, his handlers may actually see these sorts of attacks more clearly.

Clinton is the ultimate insider's candidate.  I suspect (and please tell me if I'm mistaken) that the vanilla responses from Democrats we saw in 2000,2002 and 2004 were the work of the McAuliffe-Clinton wing of the party.  If those are the folks telling Clinton how to respond, we are in serious doo-doo.


by the mollusk on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 12:55:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Big Issue for Non-Obama supporters (none / 0)

the McAuliffe-Clinton wing had nothing to do with 2000 and Gore won.  He made the mistake of thinking the courts would be fair.  What he should have done was called on people to get just as down and dirty as the bushes did.  That was the one thing he could have done differently.  But it had to happen before a SCOTUS spoke because after that it was over.

The vanilla responses you saw in 2004 were from a whole different group of players.  Clinton's team is sharp.  Don't imagine they don't have plenty of information to hit back with.  I am sure they would prefer to stick to the issues and so far that is what they are doing.  But even at that they are making Obama look bad.  Unfortunately for them they have a media that has decided to give Obama and Edwards a pass on everything and make Clinton look bad.  

The media is manipulating this horse race and have decided that Obama will be easy to beat in 2008.  He also makes a good story in the meantime.


ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:01:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Big Issue for Non-Obama supporters (none / 0)

Amazing that the majority who share your opinion on this site are Clinton supporters.  Everyone else things you are full of shit.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 02:41:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: from Liberal Lenses (2.00 / 2)


The biggest disconnect with some here is that they keep looking at Obama from the eyes of a Liberal Democrat.

They judge Obama from a perspective of a Liberal White person.

They keep forgetting, sometimes intentionally ignoring the fact that Most Americans don't share their open views. Most voters are not as accepting to other cultures or minorities as Liberals are.

They keep forgetting that you are in the LEFT of majority of americans.

As I've said repeatedly, it is No Coincidence that 70% of duly elected current Democratic Governors are indentified with Centrist/DLC/Moderate Democrats. ( The same type of Democrats that is HATED fiercely by many Liberal democrats)

Again, it is no coincidence that close to 70% of All duly elected Democratic Senators are indentified with Centrist/Moderate/DLC Democrats.

Why? Because elections are still won right in the MIDDLE! Most americans are neither right or left. But most americans are still tilted to the right of center when it comes to cultural,family & religious values.

Thus, you see all these so called "moderate democrats doing very well year after year in Statewide offices even in Red states.

The Bayhs, Bredensen's, Sebellius, Brady's, Beebee's, Landruie's, Nelson's, Machin's, Baucus, Easley's, Pryor, Lincoln, Napolitano, Salazar's, Fredeunthal, Ritter, Strickland, Culver, Warner, etc etc etc.

We can go on and on. All Statewide elected democrats doing very well in Red & Purple states.

These are the states that will give the  Obama candidacy the Mt. Everest challenge.

As I've said, the entire Liberal establishment combined with the entire African-American establishment can UNITE as one & it still won't be enough to give Obama a win in the General election.


by labanman on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 10:50:16 AM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine . (none / 0)

None of what you mentioned is going to matter at all. And as for your opinion that most americans are to the right of where liberals are politically, as a whole that is simply not true.  Progressive positions on health care, trade, econmics generally, the role of government generally and even social issues are all favorable to progressive positions.

I think this month will be the big test for Obama.  HRC is going very negative in Obama.  IF he handles that, he can handle anything the Rs throw at him.  IF he cant, then your problem is solved.


Andy Katz
by Andy Katz on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 11:03:05 AM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would (none / 0)

I think Obama's responses to the Clinton camps pathetic attempts to attack him have been pretty quick and sharp, and he doesn't even LIKE going after other Democrats.  

The Republican attack machine will get it's ASS handed to it by Obama.


by ArkansasLib on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 11:36:07 AM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

this is the equivalent of the attacks on hillary saying she can't get elected because she's a women or too polarizing, etc. nonsense. similar nonsense here. sure there's sexism, and sure -- per Obama -- there's racism and islamophobia. but he's a tremendously strong candidate and, frankly, the really vicious racists and islamaphobes ain't gonna be voting Dem, anyway, the same way the Hillary haters (except the Nader fringe) won't be voting Dem, anywa.

his real weakness is lack of experience, on that I agree.


by CalDem on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 11:49:54 AM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

Fair points... although all the credit Hillary is taking from Bill's presidency, she wasn't a part of.  She wasn't responsible for the economic growth.  In fact her biggest profile campaign was a failure.  So not sure where all this leadership experience Hillary claims to have comes from.  She was the wife of a president and has 7 years as a Senator.  That's IT in elected office or really appointed office (such as Richardson and the cabinet positions.)  I give her credit for being able to sell that line of crap, as I chastise Obama and Edwards for letting her get away with it... but its one of biggest bundles of spun crap ever seen in an election.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 02:45:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would (none / 0)

If Hillary gets nominated, what makes you think the Repubs won't use Hillary to make themselves immune from the Iraq blunder which she was part of until recent months? They all can say the same thing Hillary does, "oh, we are not Bush, we could have implemented it better" or some nonsense like that.

The Clinton attacks in the 90s did not work because Bill had the charm to deflect some of that and a lot of those attacks were so over the top nasty that the public tuned it out. The attacks they have in store for Hillary this term are going to be different.


by Pravin on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:34:46 PM EST

thanks for your concern. (none / 0)


by pmb on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:37:21 PM EST

Re: The Rep Attack Machine Would Eat Obama Alive. (none / 0)

If any other African-american with the civil rights movement and experience behind him would be comparable skills to Obama, then this issue would not be a problem!

But Obama is an unknown!  What we have come to know about him is a fairy tale!

And that is why he is a troublesome candidate inn this election;  maybe in future when he establishes himself further in our eyes, perhaps. But not now!

And he has helped to divide the democratic party as well in this round!


by pate on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:46:48 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

I guess it comes down to whether you believe Obama will be brought down by racism and his unusual name, or whether he won't. Frankly I think it's unknowable. Clinton and Edwards have weaknesses of their own, and Obama has his own strengths. Honestly I think any of them could win against any of the republicans. Who is more likely to win, who is really more electable? I don't know, and anyone who thinks they know ought to back up their assertions with evidence and preferably a track record of correct predictions. Electoral politics is a highly unpredictable crapshoot, and in the absence of that concrete knowledge I'm just going to go with who I think who would be the best president.


by Korha on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:48:36 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine (none / 0)

At this point, according to RAS, Barry beats Huck by 4. So stop trying to embellish that fact rssrai. Actually the number is down significantly, as are HRC's #'s. However, it has been proven time and time again that HRC does better in the south than Barry or JRE. Matter of fact, JRE is currently losing his own state by a landslide.


by lonnette33 on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 01:55:11 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine (1.00 / 2)

Call Him Barack, you disrespectful, ignorant cow.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 02:42:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Republican Attack Machine (none / 0)

Make me!


by lonnette33 on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 03:14:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

so you and general sherman are the same (none / 0)

person?  He is the only person I have seen on this site ignorant enough to use that name on anyone.


ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 03:24:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Republican Attack Machine (none / 0)

So isn't JRE's #'s increasing nationally or Barry's for that matter?  **crickets**


by lonnette33 on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 07:57:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat (none / 0)

If Barack Obama, a "neophyte" as you people like to call him, can defeat the Clinton Machine, I think all of these concerns about whether he's tough enough for the general election will go away.  If not, well, it certainly raises questions about how viable Senator Clinton would have been if she got bested by a newbie.


by Namtrix on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:08:25 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

Right Wing stuff would be nudge nudge..wink wink..
passt...shush..(nigger)

C'mon folks let's not tip toe...
Almost 40 years after the King assignation..

Fuck those three toed red necks
in Alabama, California, Utah, Pennsylvania ..
shit all 50 States have'em..

Obama is their worst nightmare... real African father and a white women.

...who spoke out against the war early..

So let'sm attack if he is the Dem candidate.
Time to shake this tired nation....

Of course the ideal ticket for a real all in?

Edwards/Obama  
     v

Huckabee/Gen?(or hell McCain would probably do it.)

Edwards takin' on the big money...
and Obama to find out if we move beyond racism...


"If you want to end war and stuff, you gotta sing loud"...Arlo Guthrie
by nogo war on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:28:44 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

Of course the ideal Democratic Candidate is not available...but I did cast my first legal vote for her.

http://nh.essortment.com/shirleychisholm _ruol.htm


"If you want to end war and stuff, you gotta sing loud"...Arlo Guthrie
by nogo war on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:36:43 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

God/Goddess Bless America
(The first vote I ever cast was a write-in)
http://www.nyc.gov/html/records/media/ch isholm300k.asx
"If you want to end war and stuff, you gotta sing loud"...Arlo Guthrie
by nogo war on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 04:47:25 PM EST

Re: The Republican Attack Machine Would Eat Obama (none / 0)

this transcends obama. people bitch a lot about the country being on the wrong track, but people should examine within themselves their own fear of change.


I really don't understand how that is an attack; lol. ~ by Jerome Armstrong
by jello on Tue Dec 04, 2007 at 08:33:12 PM EST


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